I ran pucks with my Pro-Comp lift on the ZJ for years without a problem.

 

How could you think that spacers can wear out springs? That doesn't make any sense to me.

 

I think the implication is that with the extra travel that the BB allows, you can wheel harder, and that is what wears out the stocker coils.

 

yea you can compress the spring and extra 2" basically since you have another 2" of uptravel that you gain with the bb.

 

No, it will no wear out your springs.

 

It still doesn't make any sense. The spring will only compress so far, and with the added 2" on top the spring still only compresses as far as it would stock. You can't compress the 2" spacer so you can't count that in the added compression your talking about. The only thing i can think of is the fact that when you do bring the suspension down past stock height, the suspension is trying to pull itself back up in place of where it was stock. So the spring is getting forced against more than it would at regular height and that could account for the increased wear, but with adjustable control arms, you could subtract that from the possibility.

 

Iwith the extra travel that the BB allows, you can wheel harder

How does a BB allow you to wheel harder? That's retarded! I've seen stock rigs get wheeled harder than built rigs! Usually b/c the owner know what it can do and knows how to wheel! Driver makes up a lot of where a rig can and can't go or do!

 

I've been running the 2 inch BB ontop of the 4.5 springs for about 4 years, no problems.


Hunter

 

what did you have to do when you added the spacers? (what had to be replaced/fixed/lengthened

 

I've been running the 2 inch BB ontop of the 4.5 springs for about 4 years, no problems.

[smilie=bal_cool.gif] The answer I was looking for!

 

It still doesn't make any sense. The spring will only compress so far, and with the added 2" on top the spring still only compresses as far as it would stock. You can't compress the 2" spacer so you can't count that in the added compression your talking about. The only thing i can think of is the fact that when you do bring the suspension down past stock height, the suspension is trying to pull itself back up in place of where it was stock. So the spring is getting forced against more than it would at regular height and that could account for the increased wear, but with adjustable control arms, you could subtract that from the possibility.

Adding a 2" spacer (and no bumpstop extensions) will give you about 2" more of uptravel. Think about it -- when you add the spacer, you are increasing the distance between the bumpstop and coil bucket by 2". Thus, when fully flexed, a spring with a 2" spacer on top if it compresses more than a spring without one. In theory, that could cause premature wear of the spring. Using the same logic, if bumpstop extensions were added, there shouldn't be any excessive wear to the spring. In addition to preventing the shocks from bottoming out and limiting uptravel to prevent tire rubbing, bumpstops also prevent the coil from overcompressing.

Now that being said, I'm not entirely convinced the extra compression really significantly increases the wear to the springs. I'm sure the springs were over-engineered from the factory to allow for some overcompression without wearing too badly. Of the people I know and what I've read on the forums, I have never seen or heard of anyone having problems with their springs with a BB and no bumpstop extensions. I'm not saying it can't happen, or hasn't happened, though.

Bottom line, put in the spacers and wheel the #2 out of it. Extend your bumpstops if you don't want to risk wearing out the springs

 

I have extended bumpstops, all adjustable control arms and have trimmed the besqueezies out of the fenders.

Hunter

 

I see what your saying about increasing the distance up before the tire contacts the inside of the fender, but what case does that give for the 2" spacers wearing out the springs? That just says to me that the springs were worn out by flexing, not just because the spacers were on there.

 

Bottom line for THIS thread is; if you dont want to wear out your coils, keep it on blocks. Driving wears them out...going over rocks wears them out faster, etc. EVERYTHING will break eventually. [smilie=bal_cool.gif]

IF you are going to use a 2" BB to keep it from flexing into your fender, then it cant possibly be the BB that will cause them to wear out faster...but if you install them and still let your tires travel to the same point, of course the spring will be compressed more and wear out faster.

Iwith the extra travel that the BB allows, you can wheel harder

How does a BB allow you to wheel harder? That's retarded! I've seen stock rigs get wheeled harder than built rigs! Usually b/c the owner know what it can do and knows how to wheel! Driver makes up a lot of where a rig can and can't go or do!

I was just giving a reason why a guy in another thread may have said what he did about the BB and STOCK springs.

BUT, if you want to know WHY the guy said/implied it...

First, your anecdote about a stock Jeep...
You have a 7 inch lift. Are you saying your spring travels as much as my stock coil? 'Cause I would say yours moves MUCH more, UP and down... I think the term is "Flexing" [smilie=bal_ask.gif]

Ask yourself; if YOU were in a stock GC, could YOU wheel as "hard" as you could with a 7" lift? Yes or no?



Now for the facts.
If you take a stock coil, it can ONLY compress up to the wheel well. It has a natural end point. If you add two inches to the distance, it can compress 2 inches more... (That means it is 2 inches closer to the fully compressed state.) Therefore it gives more travel, or; allows for harder wheeling...

With that 2 extra inches of travel they will wear out faster. Mechanical FACT.

In addition, MOST unlifted Grands NEVER leave a graded trail or even a paved road. The more they do, the faster the parts wear. The more lift and bigger tires you have, the more you are likely to take on more obstacles with your jeep, and the more you are going to workout the parts.

ANY spring can only be compressed so many times, and a BB only adds to the fatiguing stress. Those are just two reasons, from a sociological and mechanical view, that shows without a doubt that you are stressing a spring more with a BB than without unless you add 2" longer bumpstops.



NOW, my opinion would be that a stock coil is made primarily for paved roads and a very limited number of high compressions, where an aftermarket coil should be engineered for a higher number of high compressions and therefor should be less susceptible to the issue. But that is my educated guess.

However, it is more than likely that a stock coil (being that it is JEEP) has PLENTY of resilience to handle most off-road situations, or there would not be BB's and it would be called a Buick or some Sh*t. Of course if your coil is weak or mis-manufactured for what ever reason, the situation will surely be exacerbated by the addition of higher stresses. But I dont see it mattering in MOST cases...


"I've seen stock rigs get wheeled harder than built rigs!"

What you have "SEEN" and what is normal are not the same thing.
I have seen a guy run around shooting at people without a jaw like nothing happened...does not mean the average person who gets their jaw shot off will do the same? Shit no. MOSt will stop fighting. We are talking averages here, not some abnormality you have "seen."



The ONLY thing that matters in this is basic physics and engineering. Springs wear out. The more they work, the faster they wear out. What could cause them to work more? Pot holes, rocks, speed bumps... giving them more room to compress. It may not be perceptible, but it is a reality. It might make it to a million miles, and only lose you 100, but it is a certainty that it shortens the life to work it harder. Just taking it off road will shorten the life for crying out loud. EVERYTHING has an effect. A BB does also if you dont prevent the spring for compressing that extra 2".






PS: The reason I feel qualified to answer is because it is a simple mechanical situation, not something only an expert would know... For the answer on how much it actually matters is something I cant give, cause I dont have any clue on the actual specs on the parts. If someone gave me the specs I could calculate the failure point of both situations in a few days or weeks... hook it up.

 

Oh, it is not the BB that does it. IF there is any reason, it is the extra flex you would get, OR the amount of time you spend off the pavement. The BB itself is not a reason for anything.

Anyone who lifts a grand to wheel will spend more time wheeling... duh.

:mrgreen:

 

A BB does also if you dont prevent the spring for compressing that extra 2".

Hence the extended bumpstops... makes sense...

Oh, and thanks for the in-depth answer. That was pretty cool that you took the time to type that all out. Thanks!

Another thing, while we're on BBs... when I installed some spacers on my old XJ, I used a spring compresser that was a pain in the friggen rear. Just wondering if there's any other easier ways. Was thinking about unhooking a couple things, jacking up one side, letting the other drop and see if I could just slide the coil out... you think it can be done?

 

xj's have coils in the rear? you might get it to droop enough to pop out the coil with out tires on... if not id say just get a spring compressor

 

Yea, it can be down with ton of weight pushing the axle down out of the way. The spring compressor is the easiest way. That's why the tool was invented.

 

ive been told to use a combination method. compress the spring on the jeep as much as possible then use the "compressor" more as a retainer

 

ok, stock setup, the spring does not get a chance to be compressed completely because the axle eventually hits the bumpstop and stops. when you put a bb on the spring can be compressed slightly more before hitting the bumpstop. if you don't relize this than sucks to be you. its very simple. so everyone that gave this guy crap for asking this question go look in the mirror and call yourself the not so smart guy. because if you think that a bb cannot effect your spring life at all, YOU ARE WRONG. is it enough though to not get a bb? no.

 

Okay,

flame fest over.

Hunter